Recruiting wish list???

Forum Forum Lehigh Sports Lehigh Football Recruiting wish list???

This topic contains 48 replies, has 12 voices, and was last updated by  TMH 5 years, 11 months ago.

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 49 total)
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  • #16513

    TheCobbler
    Participant

    Bison,

    If a enrolled Freshman at Villanova on need based financial aid decides to walk-on to the football team in the spring of his Fr year, that $ does not count towards Villanova’s 63 scholarships.

    With the same scenario at a PL school, the $ counts towards the football team’s 60 scholarships. Therefore the only walk-on’s PL schools can add to their rosters are ones who are paying full tuition.

    #16515
    RichH
    RichH
    Participant

    Ambiguous. Most restrictions apply to “recruited” athletes. LU has WOs like Grelis and Nana. Were they recruited ,are they getting need aid? Does it count vs PL cap? As of now,all aid is to be counted. A mystery ,so far,how that is to be computed. Caveat,may well be that PL and ADs have an actual working plan in place,just not published.

    #16522

    LU15
    Participant

    Actually that could be great, Rich, could you please start the thread for Olshanski?

    #16523
    RichH
    RichH
    Participant

    Okey Dokey :).

    #16525
    Bison137
    Bison137
    Participant

    Quote: “Ambiguous. Most restrictions apply to “recruited” athletes. LU has WOs like Grelis and Nana. Were they recruited ,are they getting need aid? Does it count vs PL cap? As of now,all aid is to be counted. A mystery ,so far,how that is to be computed. Caveat,may well be that PL and ADs have an actual working plan in place,just not published.

    I do think there is a non-published set of rules in place. A lot of the talk on this subject seems to be more speculation than anything. A true unrecruited “walk-on” who gets need-based aid under the same rules as an ordinary student may not count towards the limit.

    As for being recruited, there are fairly good NCAA guidelines. Don’t have time to look them up, but I think they are:

    – No official visit
    – No offer of financial aid from coaches etc
    – No off-campus meeting with any coach

    I would love for the PL to tell everyone the exact guidelines.

    • This reply was modified 6 years ago by Bison137 Bison137.
    #16527
    RichH
    RichH
    Participant

    Agreed. As to true WOs and need aid,your approach makes sense. Not that that has ever been a determining factor with some PL policies. Allowing need aid to suuplement merit aid up to 63 just should not be a major issue.

    #16530

    TheCobbler
    Participant

    Unfortunately, what I have described is not speculation but reality. I know High School coaches who have been told this by multiple PL coaches. The league does not want to have to differentiate between who was recruited and who is a “true” walk-on. Understandably, that could be a very grey area.

    The NCAA manual is available online. The NCAA restrictions for FCS football are 63 scholarships and 85 “counters”. So you can only have 85 guys receiving ANY form of aid. You can still only have 63 football scholarships. But in theory you could have 63 full scholarships and 22 need based financial aid players on the roster. Anyone on a football scholarship (even partial) is a counter. I believe an athlete on non-athletic fin aid is not a counter until the athlete plays. I know an athlete who does not receive any fin aid is never a counter regardless of whether or not he plays.

    Just for sake of example, lets say Delaware has 63 full scholarship players and 22 need based players who all receive 1/2 tuition in fin aid which is perfectly legal by NCAA rules. Under PL rules, they would have 74 scholarship equivalencies well above the 60 allowed.

    Just another disadvantage PL programs face.

    #16571
    Bison137
    Bison137
    Participant

    Quote: “The NCAA manual is available online. The NCAA restrictions for FCS football are 63 scholarships and 85 “counters”. So you can only have 85 guys receiving ANY form of aid. You can still only have 63 football scholarships. But in theory you could have 63 full scholarships and 22 need based financial aid players on the roster. Anyone on a football scholarship (even partial) is a counter. I believe an athlete on non-athletic fin aid is not a counter until the athlete plays. I know an athlete who does not receive any fin aid is never a counter regardless of whether or not he plays.

    Just for sake of example, lets say Delaware has 63 full scholarship players and 22 need based players who all receive 1/2 tuition in fin aid which is perfectly legal by NCAA rules. Under PL rules, they would have 74 scholarship equivalencies well above the 60 allowed.

    Just another disadvantage PL programs face.”

    – – – – – – –

    I think your math is a bit misleading. In most cases, the NCAA equivalency count would be the same 74 as the PL. Any recruited football player who receives need-based aid is a counter and the amount of money he receives (including need-based grants or loans) is counted towards the limit of 63 equivalencies – per NCAA rules. The bylaws have a very precise definition on what makes someone a “recruit”.

    The one possible loophole a school like Delaware might occasionally have is that need-based aid not in any way based on athletics might not count the first year if a player is redshirted. But for it not to count, the aid would have to be identical to what a non-athlete receives, meaning no loans converted to grants beyond the normal policy for non-athletes. In any event, most of their need-based aid would count towards the limit of 63 equivalencies. Note that it is different in sports other than football and basketball.

    • This reply was modified 6 years ago by Bison137 Bison137.
    #16575

    TheCobbler
    Participant

    Bison,

    What is misleading? In my example Delaware can have 22 guys from lower income families that qualify for 50% tuition in need based aid, the same as a non-athlete. Even if they are all “counters”, which I don’t think they are until they play, the program is still below the NCAA 85 limit. The PL rules do not allow this. Even need based aid, the same as a non-athlete would receive, is part of the 60 scholarships allowed by the PL.

    You may think it’s a loophole, but it’s how FCS programs survive. No other way to keep roster numbers in place. The PL is going to learn the hard way that their rules need to change.

    #17016

    TMH
    Participant

    By my count,there is 24 roster spots opening up next year due to graduation, unless the roster is required to shrink again next year. I am also not aware of any potential 5th year seniors. By position, we will be losing

    Wide Receivers 4
    Quarterbacks 3 (1)
    Running Backs 1 (1)
    Defensive Backs 3
    Defensive Line 4
    Linebackers 3 (2)
    Tight Ends 2
    Offensive Line 3 (2)
    Kicker 1

    I think that provides a road map for what our coaches are looking to recruit. Bracketed #s are positions we already have commitments for. With the addition of Mayes, we are stocked at QB and we could probably use another RB.

    #17017
    RichH
    RichH
    Participant

    My count also. Best athlete/player. Dont care where as long as he is that much better than what we have. TE probably biggest need depthwise but under current scheme we can just move an OL into that spot.Next 8 weeks will be interesting.

    #17018
    van
    van
    Participant

    Looks like WR and DL need attention, other than Pelletier no other WR has impressed and DL, Cavenas and ??

    #17019
    RichH
    RichH
    Participant

    Lots of WRs on roster. Kelsey is real and a game changer. Casey has the resume. Like Kelsey an A-S WR. I would include Knott but he has been fragile. Howard and Anderson seem solid. Potential is a dangerous word tho.If we have a shot at better,I hope we take it.
    DL ,Cavenas and who? Stubbs is good as is Palma. Gille and Johnson,I have hopes for. Mitchell got a lot of PT. The puzzler is Brad Smith. A work in progress? A NG s/b a priority. Also,CBs. Another Andrews or Cribbs would be nice.
    As TMH noted 24 srs. Dont expect a larger class this year but perhaps more full ride recruits.

    #17028

    Miller
    Participant

    A good recruiter will not only look at film and evaluate numbers but look into the soul of a young man and decide if he is a good fit for the program. My wish list is core group of guys with high IQ football minds that are tough hard nosed kids with heart and desire. My evaluation of recent classes is that we have become soft with zero emotion. Stars and honors are nice, but our best players from the past were about hard work and no quit. Scholarships are a great tool for recruiting, but we haven’t capitalized yet, but………our best recruiting coaches are not here any more. Hope we do well

    #17115

    chipwho
    Participant

    TMH… have not been with you for a while.. heard a rumor..Brandon Yo… left school… few others may be doing the same…. will continue to review.

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