November 6, 2015 at 1:55 am #23298
He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts – for support rather than for illumination. ~Andrew Lang
Seems appropriate for this thread.
I tend to use the eye test. Lum was a winner his junior and senior year with two wins against Lafayette, two PL championships and two playoff wins against power FBS conference opponents.November 6, 2015 at 2:47 am #23300
Thank you so much for making my case (unintentional I assume).
Earlier in this thread, I posted the following:
“In all honesty, the biggest difference between any of our QBs is how good the defense is playing. If we score 24 ppg and the defense is giving up 12, that QB is going to be remembered far more fondly than the QB who led an offense that garnered 24 ppg and the defense gave up 32.
It’s not right…but it’s absolutely true”
In 2010, CL’s junior year, Lehigh’s offense averaged 23.3 ppg. Their defense only allowed 23 points in 3 games. They lost all 3. We did however win the PL, thanks in large part to the defense and we remember the QB play with great affection.
This year, our offense under a junior QB (mostly) is averaging 26.6 ppg. Our defense has held the opposition under 23 ppg in 3 games. We won all 3. The “eye test” however now wants to bench the QB and fire the OC. For some reason, after we beat Bucknell by only scoring 21 points, the “eye test” talked about how good our offense looked that game. Why can’t anyone other than Rich see how screwed up this logic is?
Don’t even bother comparing the stats of the junior QBs. It doesn’t help your argument.November 6, 2015 at 2:54 am #23301
I’ve got NO horse in this race between Miller and TMH, but feel like stoking the fire — assuming my math is correct:
The year Lum threw all those picks — his senior year:
3 percent of his passes were picked; he had a TD-INT ratio of 1.88, and a passer rating of 146.8.
Now compare Lum and Shaf junior years:
Lum: 3.3 percent picked; 1.41 TD-INT ratio; 128.5 rating
Shaf: 3.9 percent picked; 1 TD-INT ratio; 132.09 rating
There’s no comparison in rushing yardage … I did not check rushing TDs
Not sure what this settles, if anything. In part it goes to show you can argue about all sorts of numbers.
They’re fun to debate (in a civil fashion) — but often don’t settle anything.November 6, 2015 at 3:00 am #23302
Lum and Shafnisky are hard to compare because of their different styles and the systems they played in. Further, the defense was much better for Lum which can have a significant impact on field position, and opportunities. There are enough stats out there for anyone to support their theories.November 6, 2015 at 3:08 am #23303
Debate in a civil manner is all I am trying to do. We all love Lehigh. We all knew tha Lum was an incredible talent and that Mayes will be too. I am simply trying to put things into perspective. With that being said, to complete your analysis
Lum in 2010 58.0% completion 228yds rush 2 TD
Shaf in 7+ games 65.5% comp 576 rush 8 TD
My point is this, the 2 QBs are at least comparable in their Jr seasons. What differentiates them is the defense that played with them. If Groome and Co were playing this year, we would absolutely win the PL and exalting Shaf. If the current defense was playing in 2010, they may have won 3 games and this crowd would have been calling for BB and we would have missed out on Lum’s incredible senior season. The future looks incredibly bright. Let’s just relax and enjoy it.November 6, 2015 at 3:28 am #23306
Sunday,hawkineer,ngineer,TMH,thank you all.
Lehigh has had lots of great QBs,not all had winning seasons. The difference,as has bern noted before,is the D. Ours has shown flashes,evrn an entire half once but over 8 games has not been able to limit a pass offense or play an entire game. A clone of Hank’s teams.For us to win on Saturday,our D has to at the very least replicate the first half of last week.November 6, 2015 at 3:42 am #23307
Agreed, TMH … Your post No. 23300 was well-done; you must have posted it while I was researching mine. And you’ve always been a gentleman.November 6, 2015 at 3:44 am #23308
Yes, everyone calm down – this is supposed to be fun Remember this – football is the definition of a team sport. It takes 11 men on each side of the ball to do their job to have a chance to win. Tom Brady without an O-line would be horrible. It’s fun to debate and we all know you can’t really compare as all situations and teams are different. We’ve had some really good QB’s, even a few who were NFL candidates (Lum & BB). Like Lum, BB was also in the mix for the Walter Payton Award conversation until he got hurt (and he only played 7 games for us!). Fun to watch, be calm and lets beat HC Saturday!!November 6, 2015 at 3:47 am #23309
[quote=23308]Yes, everyone calm down – this is supposed to be fun Remember this – football is the definition of a team sport. It takes 11 men on each side of the ball to do their job to have a chance to win. Tom Brady without an O-line would be horrible. It’s fun to debate and we all know you can’t really compare as all situations and teams are different. We’ve had some really good QB’s, even a few who were NFL candidates (Lum & BB). Like Lum, BB was also in the mix for the Walter Payton Award conversation until he got hurt (and he only played 7 games for us!). Fun to watch, be calm and lets beat HC Saturday!!
You must be logged in to reply to this topic.